Stephen Rollnick provides consultancy, mentorship and training on the subjects of motivation, change, teamwork and Motivational Interviewing. He an Honorary Distinguished Professor in the School of Medicine in Cardiff University, Wales, UK with a research record focused on good practice in efforts to promote change and behaviour change among patients, clients and the practitioners who serve them.
Stephen's new book 'Coaching Athletes to Be Their Best: Motivational Interviewing in Sports' reveals why conventional ways of giving feedback and addressing conflict are often counterproductive, the book presents tried-and-tested methods for getting through to athletes and helping them to thrive.
In this fascinating conversation we explore:
- Why connecting with people is simple but very hard - How to roll with resistance - The secret to 'empathic listening' - How to avoid becoming a 'deficit detective'
Here is the link to the publisher's of Stephen's Book, you can get a 25% discount by using the code AFSPO at checkout.
To access the 'bonus episode' which I recorded with Dr Tim Anstiss in a web workshop with the Conclave learning community head over to https://www.patreon.com/thetalentequation
Kendal McWade from Instinctive Golf is back.
Recently, he dropped by for a visit for 2 days. He came to watch me coaching my regular Wednesday night group and then he coached a friend of mine as well as working me on my game and also coaching my son.
After dinner, we recorded some reflections of our experiences and shared our thoughts on our respective approaches and methods.
Some themes in this conversation are:
How to praise without giving praise
The difference and similarity of approach between team games and individual games
The nature of feedback and how most coaches and players are 'outsourcing feedback'
Our different approaches to questioning
Why coaching sessions should make the player's head hurt
....and a lot more
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I love coaching children...it is a real privilege. I honestly believe that it is one of the most fun things that you can do. Yes it's a challenge and yes it has it's ups and downs but if you want to do something that gives you a genuine sense of contribution and personal well being I challenge you to find something better than coaching a group of children. When you are standing on a sideline watching the play, worrying about making sure that everyone gets enough pitch time and whether they will be able to compete against the much bigger, more experienced kids they are playing against and one of the kids turns to you and starts telling you all about the laser quest she is going to do for her birthday party a week later, it kind of puts things into perspective. I smile, crouch down and and say, "wow that sounds awesome...now, see this game over here, tell me what is going on and what you are going to do when you get on?" I have to raise my voice a little bit...not in any kind of chastising way...just to make myself heard over the noise coming from nearby. About 15 yards away from me are the opposition 'coaches'...they haven't got time to be talking to the kids on the sideline, they are in the zone...they are passing on their knowledge to their players...they want to make sure that they are all following the instructions and doing the 'correct' things. "Charlie, pass, pass to Liam...pass to Liam...PASS IT." "Maria...watch out for him...watch out for him....good tackle....pass it". "NOOOOO! Sam...don't do that!" They are what a great coach and communication expert, Reed Maltbie (check out his TED talk on communication here) calls 'joystick coaches'. They want to control what is going on on the pitch and their instructions are designed to ensure that the players do what they want them to do. Now some readers might be thinking..."that is fair enough isn't it...the children don't know what to do. They need to give them instruction otherwise they wouldn't be coaching and the children wouldn't be learning...they are kids after all...they don't know what to do!" This is where I would differ...telling kids what to do isn't coaching...telling kids what to do is instruction...and I would argue that following instructions isn't learning...the kids aren't making decisions...they aren't exploring the best way to do something...they are just trying to comply. In my view, getting kids to comply with instructions isn't coaching...coaching needs to have an element of learning and development within it! As a general rule I try and be really quiet on the sideline (not easy for me!). If I do say something to a player it is in the form of a question.... Olly where is the space? Reuben who can you pass to? The questions are designed to raise their awarenes and to engage their minds, the question needs to be answered with an action, they have to think about what to do... An instruction, on the other hand, needs to be obeyed, carried out, followed. It involves no mental engagement...it doesn't encourage thinking and understanding. I don't want the players to follow or obey...I want to help them become more aware... I want to draw their attention to things that they might not be aware of and make them more aware of the problem they need to solve. I want them to explore how they can solve the problem through play and exploration... I want to help them to learn! I like to think of it like a detective story and I am the crime writer...I am asking them to solve a mystery...the mystery that is the game...I provide them with clues to help them solve the mystery but they have to piece together these bits of information to work out how to solve the mystery. Instead of a 'who dunnit' I present a 'how dunnit'. If I give them the answer too soon by instructing them or telling them what to do then where is the intrigue? What is the hook to get the individual engaged and wanting to find out more? Where is the satisfaction of solving the mystery? After each game we explore how they solved the problem...I help them to review the things they did to find a solution. I see this as a gift...the gift of problem solving, the gift of awareness. By becoming aware of the problem they can start to develop the tools to tackle the challenge. It's like when Sherlock explains to Watson how he arrived at a specific conclusion...all the little clues that he picked up that wouldn't be noticed by anyone else and how he pieces them all together... except in this case the kids are the amazingly intuitive Sherlock...and all to often, I am the bumbling unaware Watson... Just as Watson is constantly amazed by Sherlock's ability to see and sense the solution to the problem...I am amazed by their ability to identify what they need to do and to work it out for themselves. It is so rewarding to see some of the things they come up with...the creative ways that they try and play the game...some of the techniques they come up with to get the ball where it needs to go...some of the ways that they try to pass to find the space...how they get out of tight spots... It is genuinely a joy to behold! It is truly wonderful! There is only one snag.... They lose all the time! This isn't actually a problem for me...I just love watching them play...I am enthralled by the things that they try and do. I love seeing them struggle to work things out...sometimes I can actually see them wrestling with what to do...they are waiting for the picture to look right...they are trying to find the way. Quite often they try to do something but they don't quite get it right. Quite often this results in the opposition getting the ball and scoring. I just applaud them for the effort...this is the only time you hear me get vocal on the sideline..."awesome guys...that was a great effort...try again..." I can see other coaches staring at me like I am mad...my team has just conceded a goal...why aren't I telling them to do something else? What kind of a coach am I? What would I actively encourage my players when they fail and suggest that they do it again? But that's the point isn't it? The learning comes in these moments...they tried to do something but they didn't quite get the execution right...I definitely don't want them to stop doing it just because it didn't work out...I want them to do it again and find a way to succeed. Whenever this happens I think of a brilliant quote that I heard from Professor Carol Dweck, when she spoke at a conference I organised for a load of rugby coaches...she said, "we need to free children up from the tyranny of now...and lead them towards the power of yet". What she meant by this was that children should not be stopped from doing something because they aren't able to do it at that moment...they should be encouraged to try again so that they understand that there is value in the struggle of learning and improving. Instead of thinking "I can't do this..." they think..."I can't do this YET!". They aren't deterred by the failure, they don't shy away from it...they embrace it and use it as a means to get better. If we correct them and offer solutions too quickly then they just take the easy way out and follow orders...they can opt out from engaging in the learning process. And I can't deny them that opportunity...I don't want to short change them by making it too easy...I want them to receive the gift of learning and getting better. And that, in my opinion, is what coaching children's sport should be all about...learning...exploring...developing...improving...trying hard...getting things wrong...trying again...getting them wrong again...trying again...finding the way... And competition is like a test...it is a way of testing what they have learned...it is a way of measuring progress...it is a way for me to see how the children are developing their understanding of the game and how they are creating methods to exploit that. Competition for children shouldn't be about seeing how well they can follow orders...how well they comply...how well they do what they are told. Where is the fun in that? Where is the exploration? Where is the joy? And just as importantly...where is the skill acquisition? This is the problem with competition...it becomes about the result...as coaches it is easy to start doing things that are counter to our goal of developing the players abilities because we are fixated on the outcome. It would be really easy for me to give the players structure, get them to practice playing within a structure, give them the tactics and the solutions and we would probably win some games. But that would rob them of the learning opportunity... So we learn and we lose and we learn. As the World Cup winning coach of Jonny Wilkinson, Dave Alred, once said "learning happens in the ugly zone".
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